ETLB Squawk Forums — Archive

I've made the decision to not fly my Eindecker anymore.  Several incidents with this plane made me aware that I was taking more risk than I really want to at this point in my life.  I have several people who are very dependent on me and I need to put their interests first.

The first incident was last summer.  I was flying in the traffic pattern and the aileron controls locked solid in neutral position.  I had to fly the plane using rudder control only to make the landing. It turned out not to be a big problem, but could have been much worse in different circumstances.

The second incident was several weeks ago at the WW I flyin at Gardner, KS.  I took off and and had climbed up to five or six hundred feet when I saw one of the biplanes coming into the pattern.  I banked and started pulling to turn in behind the Nieuport and chase him.  As I was pulling through the turn the plane stalled and instantly dropped into a spin.  I immediately had the thought that I better not screw up the recovery or I would be a goner for sure.  I had enough altitude to recover (barely)...but not enough to make a mistake.  I was careful not to try to pull out too quickly and stall again.  I recovered at around 150-200 AGL.  At the time I wasn't all that shaken, but after having time to mull over what happened I,ve, as the Brits say, "got the wind up"

The main issue with me flying the Eindecker is that it is severely overweight.  The plane was originally designed to weigh 250 lbs and ours weighs 350.  It was designed for a gross weight of 450 lbs and with me it's flying at 600.  This just won't work.  If the engine ever quit I would be in big trouble.  I've done practice landings with the engine at idle...from 1000 AGL you have to dive at the ground maintaining over 60 mph and flair perfectly to make a landing.  There's no time to find a good landing area and setup for a safe landing.

The last factor in my decision is that I just don't have the passion for flying like I used to.  I've only flown the Eindecker 10 hours over the last year.  I started flying at age 50 and just turned 70.  I used to fly 100+ hours a year and have about 1600 hours logged but the desire just isn't there anymore.

You have my every sympathy. I am 68 and the thought has occurred to me also. I have been flying since I was 24 and it just have the allure it once had. They say that the older you get---- the older you want to get.

Hi Charlie
Hey, know what you mean. But please stay on the board. You may not want to fly, but the builders here can sure still use your advice.
I have been flying (with a pilot in the right seat ) since the early 70's. In 2003 Dwight (skyblazer) and I started to build our Max's. 2003 I started taking legal lessons in a Champ. Soloed in 2006 in my Himax. In 2012 Bought a Chief. Took my written @ 70, Got my Light Spot License on my birthday 1015 @73. Actually started the process in 1962 when I bought a Champ project. Never got it complete when first daughter was born. Got $450.00 for it to pay the Dr. bill. I still have the desire to fly when ever I can, but I can tell you this, I take no chances. My motto as some of you might remember is "when in doubt, DON'T". We are all different and same with our abilities. I have no idea when I will have to hang it up, but I am aware of my age. This must be your time, but the knowledge you have is needed right here. We old farts have a multitude of experience to share. There are a bunch young ones out there nowadays and we need to try and get some more young people interested in aviation.
So, don't go anywhere, LOL.
Bob

Sorry to see that you plan to stop flying, Charlie.
As others have said, please stay on the board because I think your comments have been very helpful.

Is it possible that you just need to stop flying the Eindecker? What you have mentioned all relates to that particular plane.

If the issue is that plane or none, I understand completely. I purchased my Tandem Airbike because it was what I could afford with the characteristics that I was looking for. Now that I am losing the hanger space a few hundred yards behind my house, I might be "hanging it up" as well.

Being just 1,000 ft. above the ground gives me a different perspective on all the turmoil reported every day. If, however, it isn't fun, then it isn't worth the trouble. Been there - done that - it was the correct decision for that time.

I wish you well. Go in peace, but not very far.

Yeah, sounds like the actual issue is the weight factor, not the pilot. Time for a different bird.

radfordc.....I think I can relate to your reservations. To use myself as an example, I have yet to fly the MiniMAX that I completed 1 1/2 years ago. Because of a issue with a failed FAA medical I'll never be able to solo in anything above an ultralight. I'm 63 years old and have wanted to fly since the late 1970's. In addition to the MIniMAX I'm 50% owner of a Kitfox, although I'll never be able to be PIC. The last time I flew the Kitfox with the other owner, who is a CFI, I told him I was really having a lot of doubt about my flying knowledge and ability. He offered assurance that with more dual time I'd be OK in the Kitfox and then the MiniMAX would seem easy. Somehow though I still have self doubts and wonder if I would be better off to stop my pursuit of flying too early than too late. I have plenty other interests and hobbies, so I'm not going to get bored. I might get blasted for my seeming "negative" view, but sometime one has to do some soul searching and do what you feel is best for yourself.

No matter what you decide, I too hope you'll be around to offer good advice to others as you always have. Best wishes!

Lynn

You're doing the right thing, your so over weighted Aircraft is too much of a risk to fly. I applaude your smart  desition. Maybe later on, with another plane, it will return you the joy of flying.

As the others have said Charlie, that is a personal decision and one that you and others can live with. It seems as though the problem is the plane, not you. You loved your AirBike and at least one other since selling that one. Perhaps you ought to consider two things: 1) donate the Eindecker to the WW I museum in Kansas City, MO. and 2) get into another plane closer to what you have been flying. I think we are about the same age (72) and I have had similar thoughts. Fortunately for me though, the thrill of planning a flight, flying the plan, and writing stories for magazines still carries more weight than extracting myself from this hobby.

Just my two cents worth.

Paul Fiebich

Good pilots make good decisions its that simple. I think you have made a good decision.

Please stay...on board...LOL

cheers Arthur

Guys, thanks for the thoughts.  I may fly again once this Eindecker situation is resolved.  It's really not a bad airplane....for a pilot weighing 165 lbs.  It's just not suited to someone as "fluffy" as me.  

well, I guess my Fat A$$ is out....

I TOO have hung up my wings.. I canceled my insurance today and my plane is here at home..

I don't plan on flying anymore unless I win the plane that is to be given away in North Dakota...

There are some planes that you fly to say you have flown it, not because you want to fly it.  A bit different but I once had a R/C Spitfire that fell into this category due to the compounding factors of high wing loading, aft CG, and wing wash IN.  It was a Little Monster and a handful when it tip stalled at the top of loops.

I later build another Spitfire from scratch and it could be hand launched and was a joy to fly.  Same size just built zealously to be light weight.

So it sounds to me like a good decision to not fly the Eindecker, tip stalls and spins are scary enough when you are not in the plane and the flight hours strongly suggest this is not a fun flyer.

But you know not all fly that way so I would not over compensate for one bad apple  

Harless didn't you just buy an Aeronca not too long ago?

Time for an update on the Eindecker situation.  After nearly spinning it in the ground I quit flying it for over a year.  Recently, we worked with Robert Baslee, the designer, to build a set of bigger wings.  We went from 23' span to 28' and from 92 sq ft of wing area to over 130.  

With the bigger wings the plane is completely different and much safer.  The stall went from 43 mph to 27 mph.  The rate of climb and rate of descent in glide are both greatly improved.  Today I got it up high and did some tight banked turns and had no issues at all.  

OUTSTANDING....well done...you must be a good pilot to make such decisions..!!

Great to hear...very happy for you.

take some time to get to know her new personality at height....safety first ...

I too have the tee shirt of a near fatal spin into the dirt...

dont ask... it scared the crap out of me...and try a 30 foot miss with the planet..!!!

Those things do make you change your decisions...so well DONE.

OHH and as the brits once said....what a great looking new kite (ie a great new aeroplane)

cheers Arthur

Glad you modified the wings to give a safe flying machine. always admired your Eindecker.

monte

Very glade you where able to solve your troubles with the airplane. It is a really good looking airplane and now you can go looking for Paul  rat ta ta ta.

Hey Guys,

              It's been several years since I did any real flying.  I've restarted my AirBike project
              and have a huge urge to fly again.  
              Just happen to open this site where some of you are talking of "Hanging-It-Up"
              Have any really done that ??
              My Dr. seems to think it would be a good idea to take a shot at it - I'm still in
              pretty good condition for my age.  I'm probably the oldest on this board !!

              What say you ??

              Ted

OK Ted, lets get this age thing out in the open, how old are you? I am 73 . My goal is to fly until I am 80 (or maybe longer).

Paul Fiebich

Hi Paul,

             Well. . . . . . believe it or not,  you're just a youngster !!!

             Come March 30, 2018  I'll be ninety-one,   Born 3-30-1927.
             Most guess me around 70.  Don't bend too well, . . .  that's
             why I selected the AirBike .... if I go upside down it won't be
             such a problem getting out of it !!  HA !

             My last flight was a year ago last April with a professor friend,
             got me up in some Ultra-lite that was powered by a Rotax 916.
             He got us on IFR and I had to get us back to normal flight.
             The last I flew before that was in 1998 in his Bonanza.
             (He was ATP rated.)  The last ride in the Ultra got me back
             in the mood !!

             Ted

Hey Ted;
That is outstanding. If you are in good health I see no reason you should "hang it up" as long as you enjoy it. You have to be the judge.
Paul, you are close to me, I am 75 and in good health. I have no plans to quit.Bob Hoover was in his 90's I think also. The FAA took away his ticket,
but had to give it back cause he passed his medical, don't quote me on that, what I heard.
Hang in there Ted and ENJOY!!!
Bob

Congrats Ted! You make us fill so young,  I think I'm a 66 years old baby.
Keep us posted.

           Most of the best pilots I know are over 65 and more experienced, safety oriented and willing to share their wide array of knowledge than some of the "youngsters" around. I'm soon to be 69 and feel fine except for a messed up back and a few other small "glitches"!!! I just got my first ultra-light 3? years ago and it's a complete adventure that makes me  feel 15. Where I live isn't the best place for getting a lot of flight time ( lotsa wind) but the time I do get is priceless!!! I plan on going till they put me in a box, God willing, if I'm not endangering anyone I''ll be waiting for those less than 10 knot days. Fly on brothers.

Quoted from Bob Hoskins Hey Ted;
Bob Hoover was in his 90's I think also. The FAA took away his ticket,
but had to give it back cause he passed his medical, don't quote me on that, what I heard.

Bob

Bob, you are correct. I was keeping track of it through articles in the AOPA magazine at the time.

Two FAA goofs watched Bob Hoover's performance in the Shrike and determined that his flying skills were impaired and demanded his medical or pilot ticket, I forget which. Bob mistakenly handed it over and he could no longer fly. This stupidity aroused the flying public around the world and one or two other countries issued Hoover a license. Hoover flew his performances outside the U.S. for a while before the Foolish Aviation Authority realized how ridiculous they were and corrected their error.

The average bear would have just been S.O.L. in the same situation.
As some famous person once said, "Absolute authority absolutely corrupts."

Hey
I am glad I was right about Bob. I watched him a few times and he was outstanding. And you are correct on the quote. You can see it all over our world right now.
Bob